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Suntory is known as one of Japan's leading alcoholic and non-alcoholic beverage manufacturers. This large corporation has launched an in-house venture subsidiary, GoodMeasure, to fully enter the web3 field.
The project is led by Highball Charlie, the initiator of the highball boom at Suntory, and Terry Tomonaga, CEO of 8Ships, a global web3 company. We spoke to these two key people about the future developments of the project, which is scheduled to begin in earnest in 2024.
First, please tell us about your background.
Highball Charlie (hereafter, Charlie): I love drinking and eating, so I joined Suntory in 1998.
During my job interview, I said, "I discovered that alcohol contains vitamins." I then asked the HR department, "What do you think vitamins are?" and then replied, "It's not A or B, it's love!" It probably doesn't affect my physical condition, but when I said, "It's a vitamin that energizes the mind!" I was thought of as an interesting guy and was hired (laughs).
After that, I was involved in various businesses and was even able to join a project team that aimed to popularize the highball way of drinking. However, when the project was successful and highballs became all the rage, I felt like I had nowhere to go.
Then, I got the opportunity to promote highballs in the United States. In these interviews, I call myself "Highball Charlie," but this is a kind of stage name I took up at that time because people in the United States didn't remember my real name.
After spending five years in the United States as Highball Charlie, I returned to Japan. When I came back, I was thinking about what to do next and that's when I came across NFTs.
Terry Tomonaga (hereafter, Terry): I was born in Japan, but lived in the United States. I worked in a bank and started and managed an international education company 20 years ago. I also built a school in Cambodia.
I always think that Japan is a wonderful country, and I think about how we can produce people who can be active globally. Japanese games and anime in particular are a great weapon.
One day when I went to New York, I had a moment when I felt the greatness of NFTs, that they are the embodiment of values, or the creation of a space where people with similar values can gather together with digital items.
Until now, there has been a tendency to value trust, relationships, and the atmosphere and tacit understanding in Japan, but it is quite difficult to convey such things to people around the world. But on the other hand, it is also one of the good things about Japan.
When I realized how amazing NFTs were, I thought they would be the strongest tool to convey the good things about Japan.
Japan needs to go out more globally. Even from the perspective of fair value, I think there is a big gap between something being bought for 100 dollars around the world and being sold for 1,000 yen in Japan.
I'm interested in using blockchain to find out how we can bridge this value gap.
Charlie: During the five years I spent in the US, I also realised how amazing Japan is.
Even when I went to Kentucky Fried Chicken, people praised Japanese cars, and in Las Vegas bars, a glass of Yamazaki on the rocks was selling for $50 to $70. In New York, a bar was selling 100 TOKI Whisky highballs a day for $20 each.
Americans don't hesitate to pay the appropriate amount for great Japanese products.
What kind of project is “SAKAZUKI NFT”?
Charlie: In a word, it is an initiative to provide a membership experience that cannot be bought with money. By doing so, we hope to build a new "Direct to Fan" business model.
For example, you can get alcohol that has not yet been released to the world, which is a challenge for makers with new techniques and ideas, through test sales. In addition to drinking alcohol, you can also experience the story and events that lead to obtaining it.
NFT provides access to such experiences that cannot be exchanged for money.
Terry: The keyword for NFT is to gain valuable experiences that cannot be exchanged for money. There are many experiences in Japan that cannot be exchanged for money. Socializing and not accepting first-time customers are also unique cultures.
We think it is important to create an environment that includes all of these things that are part of Japanese culture.
Charlie: It all started with a discussion about "Even if Suntory makes such an innovative alcoholic drink with such a high production cost, who in Japan will buy it?"
When I tried the sample made by the brewer, it was so delicious that it gave me goosebumps. However, the production cost was high, and the price was deemed too high to sell in stores in Japan, so it could not be sold. No matter how delicious it was, there was no place to test and learn. So we started with the idea of "Let's try selling it at least within a limited community first."
Also, as I mentioned earlier, people in the United States and other countries are willing to pay if it is worth it. In other words, even if a product is considered expensive in Japan, there is demand for it if it is sold overseas.
Therefore, I think that the idea that if we go global first, we can sell alcohol that the brewer thinks is truly good is also useful when thinking about community composition.
Terry: I think this project will be the key to web3. We didn't start this project to make money.
And the reason I think Suntory is a great company is because they are trying to pave the way for Japan to expand globally, just as Japanese whisky is now highly regarded around the world. I think it's amazing to be in a place where the world can change and be changed.
What made you two decide to work together on SAKAZUKI NFT?
Terry: I think a big part of it was that Charlie and I agreed on the idea of Japan's global expansion.
Charlie: To be honest, I didn't know much about NFTs until two years ago. I just had a vague desire to convey the good things about Japan in a global-first way.
Terry: I thought it might be better to create a brand overseas and re-import it. I understand that it's easier to market domestically. Still, I thought that if we started overseas, even though it would be difficult, people all over the world would see it, so we could give it value by global standards.
At the moment, web3 is something that can be started anew, but I think there are too many projects that are being carried out in the same way as before. If we do that, we'll just end up with the same answer again. I talked to Charlie about it and we agreed.
Charlie: We have created many things as Suntory, but many of them are lying dormant because they cannot be mass-produced and sold due to the time and cost required for production. I learned about NFTs and met Terry while thinking of ways to overcome this situation.
Terry even asked me if I was serious (laughs).
After that, I went to the United States and met famous founders, and when I heard Terry's desire to create a fan community to convey Japanese culture, I finally understood NFTs and the space they would create. At that point, I proposed this project to the company.
NFTs are a means to connect with customers, and a new form of engagement. I explained that it would be an emotional and more active way to show gratitude to customers.
It's still a small world, but I explained the significance of creating a business model to create a fan community, and the importance of a large company like Suntory taking on the challenge of creating a fan community using web3 technology.
This feeling was conveyed to the management, and we launched a subsidiary of Suntory called Good Measure.
I think it will be a fusion of Web2.0 and Web3.0, but are there any key aspects in the gradation section?
Charlie: At first, we thought it would be good to simply sell NFTs as "digital beer tickets" and have people receive the actual alcohol when they buy them. But then we realized that it would just be a merchandise store.
For example, we wouldn't be happy if people just bought NFTs and kept them. We need to value people who actually drink our alcohol, are surprised and pleased, and buy it again and recommend it to their friends. For that, we need an engagement system.
Terry: I think of NFTs as a system that visualizes human relationships, such as loyalty and trust. In web2, we focused on "looking good" and "showing things," but in the future, the emphasis will be on "real."
Using blockchain, we can record all that data, such as what type of alcohol a regular customer usually drinks and how much they drank. If we hold an event around the world, the participation records will also be kept.
What NFT projects around the world are focusing on now is getting people who share their community and ideas to participate.
In web2, the emphasis was on showing things widely, but in web3, the emphasis will be on being narrow and deep. In that case, physical and real things will become incredibly important.
Charlie: With SAKAZUKI NFT, you can prove that you came to the event that day through NFT. I'm happy to be able to have a drink with you and say, "Thank you! Cheers!" I think that in the future it will become a more useful tool than just exchanging business cards.
Do you think that in the future the digital world will be linked to the real world, such as restaurants?
Terry: Even though we're talking about web3, we're still at the web2.1 stage, so that hasn't happened yet, but I think it will happen in the future. In fact, there's no reason why it shouldn't. I think it would be strange not to use the assets we have to create a fanbase.
In that respect, I think the fans that SAKAZUKI NFT brings in will be of incredibly high quality and passionate.
Charlie: Right now, people who love Suntory and buy our products many times and people who buy our products occasionally are given equal rewards. By using NFTs, we can make this visible and increase the reward rate for dedicated fans.
Stores will also be able to provide special services, and I hope that this will be used in the future.
In fact, last year we held a one-night event exclusively for related parties, because we wanted to show our seriousness to our overseas partners and to show various Japanese companies that "Suntory has come this far with web3. Let's form an alliance together."
We prepared a two-story venue, set up various community experience booths on the first floor, and set up a special limited bar on the second floor. It was an event where visitors could participate in a digital stamp rally while experiencing various things, and those who collected five or more stamps were invited to the limited bar on the second floor.
The response was great, with 1,500 stamps being issued in three hours for 300 visitors. As a result of the participants' proactive actions, by the time they reached the bar on the second floor they had developed a greater affinity with Suntory alcohol, and I believe that the visitors from overseas had become fans of Japanese manufacturing.
Terry: The amazing thing about NFTs is that they can move people. They can help people realize the experiences they want to have, and I think they can be used in education and other areas. NFTs are a technology that can change the way people live.
SAKAZUKI NFT is scheduled to be fully launched in 2024, but could you tell us about the current situation and what kind of services it will start with?
Charlie: At the moment, we are looking for "passionate" supporters. Rather than suddenly asking for 10,000 people to participate, we would like to start by carefully gathering a small number of people who are genuine supporters. After that, we would like to begin full-scale sales of NFTs and expand our activities, such as holding in-person events.
We will start by getting our supporters to take action and get the word out about SAKAZUKI NFT.
Terry: There's a big web3 event in Japan in August, so I'd like to do an event where you can actually meet the creators and get a bottle.
In recent years, there's been a tendency for people from overseas to skip Japan and go to Korea or Singapore for web3-related events. In order to change this situation, it would be great if more companies could work together, not just out of mutual interest, but with the pure determination to make Japan a web3 hub.
I want to create something that can only be experienced in Japan, and I think we can compete on our own terms, rather than imitating overseas. I want to make this a project that attracts overseas web3 players to Japan for the SAKAZUKI community.
Terry Tomonaga
CEO of 8ships, a US-based web3 company. After graduating from UCLA, he is an entrepreneur and global marketing strategist who uniquely combines his expertise in psychology and Japanese studies. After starting his career at Wells Fargo, he founded the international education company LACT and the mentorship program PID.
Highball Charlie
Joined Suntory in 1998. A highball mastermind who has worked on the development of highball mugs and other products. Founder of the NFT project "SAKAZUKI" and CEO of Suntory Group web3 startup "Good Measure."
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